Fajin

[yslim]

Hi CD,
.........In case you would also like to know if I practice abdominal breathing, I actually don't. In fact, I don't breathe any other way. Ergo, I don't practice, I do it all the time. So, if you only do abdominal breathing only when you practice, I would ask, Why? So the question posed to DPasek seems sarcastic or even arrogant.
Take care,
Frank

Hi, Frank
There is an old Chinese proverb 見仁見智(The meaning is only up to the interpretation of the reader.) People do have different views about something that they read. One can take it negatively or positively. I am not being sarcastic or even arrogant. I am only probing what is in his mind. I was hoping he would give me the same answer as you did. However, I would like to hear it from him. Sorry, the message was never come across clearly to me but he was too busy denying what I have been saying.

What I am presenting here is very common in the Chinese literature. It seems to me there is a big controversy from what I am encountering here. I am regret that I don't see the same philosophy in the west. I had cited some good examples; but it seems to be meaningless to some practitioners. Sigh!

Talking about endurance. There is physical endurance and mental endurance. Someone had called me stupid. I took it as someone is entitle to one's opinion and let it go at that. Regardless who is right or wrong, why not just let the person speak, then, attack the issue until to the end. Somehow, it was not in this case. The messenger was killed before the message was delivered. Who is going to defend the messenger?

PS
Stupidity is one who start attacking the issue before listening to all the evidence of the presentation .

Good Morning CD,
BUT, all your presentations of the evidence were your 'monkey-mind'.

For exampe when you posted this: "the whole body moves as an ocean wave(動如海)."

I cannot agree more with that. "The Tai Chi principle is when one moves, the whole body moves as an ocean wave(動如海)." (動=moves, 如=as, 海=ocean. The fact is, there is no 'wave', only your alt-fact.) if you had stop here, and rid of “wave”, which you added on trying to be smart. Then I cannot agree more with that. But by adding this word “wave” to show you have the intention to emphasize your point of view when there is no “wave” in this 3 Chinese Classic saying. Thou, lack of attention to what the Ancient one actually said. This makes your point of view, blocking your view to the view-of-the-Ancient One. Precisely this “ocean” was a whole body of ocean and the "ocean wave" is the residue of the ocean movement. Why do you want to down size a whole body ocean's might to just an ocean wave?

Good Morning CD,
My previous post above was showing that you had screwed up the message by adding your worthless interpretation into it. That changed the message. You sabotaged the message, therefore your 'messenger' credential had committed a kamikaze.

As to "Who is going to defend the messenger?" We practice Tai Chi Chuan as an art of self defense. Aren't you? A "100% lung full of air" is a good starter....

[ChiDragon]

As to "Who is going to defend the messenger?" We practice Tai Chi Chuan as an art of self defense. Aren't you? A "100% lung full of air" is a good starter....
yslim

Young man! A good defender should have a healthy body to begin with. I am doing it for health for now. Whether I like it or not, the part on self defense comes with the package at the final end. In addition, as you had indicated, the sexual pleasure also comes with the same package. I am glad that you agree with a "100% lung full of air" is a good starter.... You didn't miss the important part in your learning from your sifu.

[yslim]

As to "Who is going to defend the messenger?" We practice Tai Chi Chuan as an art of self defense. Aren't you? A "100% lung full of air" is a good starter....
yslim

Young man! A good defender should have a healthy body to begin with. I am doing it for health for now. Whether I like it or not, the part on self defense comes with the package at the final end. In addition, as you had indicated, the sexual pleasure also comes with the same package. I am glad that you agree with a "100% lung full of air" is a good starter.... You didn't miss the important part in your learning from your sifu.

Good Morning CD

I am glad that you agree with a "100% lung full of air" is a good starter

is reference to your previous post of your believe;

The physical strength of the body is li(力) when the lung has the capability to fill 25 to 50% with air. It becomes jin

(勁) when the lung has the capability to fill 75 to 100% with air. It is because of the constant exercise of the muscles, the number of mitochondria has been increased tremendously.

Therefore, the physical strength is multiplied by the number of mitochondria. BTW If you still don't believe me, then, you go try to do push-hands with a real Tai Chi master.

That is not for me to agree or disagree as I have no experience of this believe.

[ChiDragon]

Fajin in Taiji has two stages which one must go through. First is to learn and be familiar with the basic form and practice for years to develop the jin in the body muscles. After a long time practice, the form should be performed spontaneously without hesitation. In addition, the breathing should be coordinated with the movements and vise versa in order to develop the jin. Second, the next stage is to learn and practice the eight most effective gestures to fajin. That is where the emphasis of the coordination in breathing and muscle movements come into play. In other words, if one had learnt the faijin gestures without the breathing coordination, then, fajin is not effective at all. Sorry to say, it shouldn't be even called fajin.

There is no special effort required to put into the coordination in breathing. The coordination between breathing and movements should be picked up from the long period of practice in the basic movements. It was done spontaneously. Unfortunately, if that was not done, don't even bother going into the stage of fajin.

[Siahn]

I originally posted this question on Aug 31, 2016 1:43 pm.

Ive just logged on for the first time in a long time and see you guys were still arguing in Jan 2018.

I think that in itself answers my original question.

[Bob Ashmore]

Siahn,
Ah, there you are!
We were beginning to doubt that you were "real"?
So are you going to answer me now? In case you've forgotten after all this time I was the one who asked you to define "real" for us so we could know how to respond.
You have not done so yet, so here's your chance to let us all know what "real" is.
That should end the debate.
I'm also the one who gave you the simplest definition of "fajin" possible, here's a reminder for you; make a fist, hit something.
Have you done that yet?
We've all been waiting for TWO YEARS for those answers, and yet all we get is a fly by pithy phrase in return?
Seriously dude, that's pretty pathetic.

The wise man is told about the Tao and attempts in vain to follow it.
The average man is told about the Tao and searches for it to no effect.
The foolish man is told about the Tao and laughs at the very idea.

So...
Which are you?
And...
Are you "real"?
Oh, I asked that already.
Bears re-asking though.

[Siahn]

I apologise Bob, I've been in a bad space recently but that's no excuse, I do appreciate the time you've taken to discuss the topic. Sincere apologies for my thoughtless remark.