translate two tiger forms

[Yongnian_matt]

One is for "strike tiger" and other is "bend bow shoot tiger."

what is the significance/history of those close fisted strikes in relation to tiger.

[ChiDragon]

It is because the tiger is the most fierce animal in China. Thus people have to defend against the tiger attack often.

[fchai]

Greetings Matt,

Like a lot of the postures in Taiji, the origin for the names are often quite obscure, and most of us do not have any absolute knowledge of the rationale for the names. Louis Swaim is one who can probably suggest where it might have its origins from, as he is most learned in the numerous treatises on Taiji as well as other ancient philosophical texts. As in past discussions on other names, the origins could have come from ancient, obscure and abstract references, and only the originator of the name can tell us with any surety what they meant. However, they are not available for consultation, as they have left our earthly plane of existence. Check out past discussions on Wild Horse Parts Mane or Embrace Tiger and Carry to the Mountain. Then you have the matter of what the original text actually meant and variations in translations and interpretations. However, you can always be inventive and imagine what it could mean. Your guess is as good as mine.

Take care,
Frank

[DPasek]

Yea, there are many possible associations that could have contributed to the selection of the form names, and scholars of Chinese literature (like Louis Swaim) or ethnic Chinese (like ChiDragon) may have their ideas, although they would only be speculations unless the person who named the forms left a record explaining their choices.

For example, one possibility (for “strike tiger”) could be the story of Wu Song: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wu_Song

Also, the Manchu rulers of the Qing dynasty descended from nomads and maintained their horsemanship skills, including bowman-ship from horseback, and would attend annual hunts that I think included shooting tigers. Since tigers were the kings of the beasts (typically depicted with the “king” character on the forehead = Wang 王), and as ChiDragon pointed out, very fierce, so defeating one would be a significant accomplishment. So shooting a tiger with a bow and arrow (for “bend bow shoot tiger”) could have come from this tradition.

But these are just some off the top of my head speculations.

[Louis Swaim]

Greetings,

Yes, these naming conventions are interesting. I don't think they refer to fighting actual tigers, but that the tiger is an image for a fierce opponent over which you must gain control.

Regarding the left and right Strike Tiger forms, I recall Yang Zhenduo addressing the posture name at a workshop in San Antonio. It was many years ago, so if anyone can clarify my recollection I would appreciate it. Master Yang did in fact refer to the Wu Song character from the Water Margin stories. He was very conversant with traditional Chinese theater and opera, and these stories are often depicted on stage. As I recall, he said that the lower fist was like grasping the tiger by the scruff of the neck or the back, and the upper fist was a strike. There are many depictions of Wu Song fighting a tiger. Here's just one example:

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/imag ... ZtEuuO_7&s

As for Draw the Bow and Shoot the Tiger, Xu Yusheng in his early taiji manual wrote: "The idea in this posture is of a person on horseback drawing a bow to shoot, hence the name." In my translation of Yang Chengfu's book, The Essence and Applications of Taijiquan, I commented, "Given the turned-out orientation of the right fist, the analogy of the posture to drawing a bow is somewhat flawed, but in other respects the opening through the back and chest, and the set-up of tension between the two arms, does resemble the drawing of a large powerful bow."

There is another notable tiger-named form, Retreat Astride Tiger. Brennan translates this "Retreat to Sitting Tiger Posture," but I take 跨虎 to mean "astride tiger," and elsewhere Brennan translates it "Riding the Tiger." In Yang Chengfu's narrative in Essence and Applications of Taijiquan, he states, "Now, although the opponent may be as fierce as a tiger, with but the slightest turning motion, he will be under my control."

Take care,
Louis

[DPasek]

Just to point out something brought up by Louis, form posture names can only be expected to reflect the postures rather than giving specific details. The turned-out orientation of the right fist in Draw the Bow and Shoot the Tiger is different than what one would have if using a finger draw technique on the bowstring. The Chinese, however, did not use the right hand in the same way – they used a wide ring worn on the thumb to pull on the bowstring. Pulling with a thumb ring would make the hand shape closer to a fist than when using a fingers draw, and the hand would be rotated slightly from what the fingers draw would use (although still not as far as in the TJQ form posture).

[global village idiot]

Building on what Dpasek and everyone else has said, I always take the names of the postures (where they don't come right out and say what to do like "Punch Groin," which name I like for its brutal simplicity) as merely suggestive and allegorical.

Dpasek makes a good point about the hand position of thumb-ring archery. I've been doing it as a pastime for about 8 months now, and the "draw" hand is as he describes. Then we go and compare it with "Pull Bow Shoot Hawk" in Ba Duan Jin, and we find the "draw" hand in a completely reversed position.

Anyone who would absurdly claim that two different hand techniques are used in shooting a bow against a tiger and a hawk would clearly be pulling this idea out of his "4th point-of-contact," and we would be entirely right not to take such a one seriously. I only bring up the amusing comparison to reinforce what others have said - that the posture names are suggestive more than they are instructive.

gvi