Yang Family Tai Chi Discussion Board

Greetings,

Any other opinions about the meaning of this word "hua2" in the source text? Jerry? Jeff? Audi?

Take care,
Louis

My understanding is that 'hua2' may contain neutralizing (my kanji is way off) while still maintaining peng but diminishing the other's pushing in a 'secret' manner.
I am recalling one of my teacher's maintaining my push and still diminishing/preventing me from gaining further ground and still preventing me from furhter movement while 'leading me into emptiness'. I know the feeling but cannot duplicate nor explain properly but if you have experienced both sides, you may have an idea!

Greetings s,

Re: "neutralizing"

No, that's a different hua, and a different character.

--Louis

This is the hua character I'm referring to: »¬.

--Louis

Hi guys,

In layman terms `hua' is an act of dispersing or nullifying. Disperse/ nullify something from becoming united, focuses and strong. E.g. we can `hua' an animosity between two person by explaination and understanding so that the factors that build the animosity feeling can be dispersed and nullified. Or we can `hua' (nullify) bad karma by doing more good and collect more good karma.

In TCC context, `hua' may be described the same. We hua by dispersing the oncoming force not allowing it to be concentrated at the intended target.

Greetings Cheefatt,

I know the hua that you mean, the transform/disolve/disperse hua. But the word I am asking for opinions about is a different hua, »¬ appearing in the line in the Yang Forty Chapters text titled, Ba-wu shisanshi changquan jie.

--Louis

[This message has been edited by Louis Swaim (edited 11-16-2005).]

Greetings,

Below is the full text. The hua character appears in the line, Íò²»µÃÓÐÒ»¶¨Ö®¼Ü×Ó£¬¿ÖÈÕ¾ÃÈëÓÚ»¬È­Ò². It is expressed as an undesireable development. --Louis

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Ô­ÎÄ£º×Ô¼ºÓù¦£¬Ò»ÊÆһʽ£¬ÓóÉÖ®ºó£¬ºÏ֮Ϊ³¤£¬ÌÏÌϲ»¶Ï¡£Öܶø¸´Ê¼£¬ËùÒÔÃû³¤È­Ò²¡£Íò²»µÃÓÐÒ»¶¨Ö®¼Ü×Ó£¬¿ÖÈÕ¾ÃÓÚ»¬È­Ò²£»ÓÖ¿ÖÈëÓÚӲȭҲ£¬¾ö²»¿ÉʧÆäÃàÈí£¬ÖÜÉíÍù¸´£¬¾«ÉñÒâÆøÖ®±¾£¬ÓþÃ×Ô È»¹áͨ£¬ÎÞÍù²»ÖÁ£¬ºÎ¼á²»´ÝÒ²¡£ÓÚÈ˶Դý£¬ËÄÊÖµ±ÏÈÒà×Ô°ËÃÅÎå²½¶øÀ´£¬Õ¼ËÄÊÖ£¬ÊÖÊÖÄëÄ¥£¬½øÍËËÄÊÖ£¬ÖÐËÄÊÖ£¬ÉÏÏÂËÄÊÖ£¬Èý²ÅËÄÊÖ£¬ÓÉϳ˳¤È­ËÄÊÖÆ𣬴󿪴óÕ¹£¬Á·ÖÁ½ô´Õ£¬ÇüÉì×ÔÓÉÖ®¹¦£¬ÔòÉýÖ® ÖÐÉϳÉÒÓ¡£



[This message has been edited by Louis Swaim (edited 11-18-2005).]

Greetings all,

I have some ideas about this, but do not have time to post them now. Basically, I wonder whether there might not be some justification for intepretating »¬ as "slide" and the meaning "slick" as a pun. My main doubts concern how to translate һν֮»¬ and Ò»»¬Ö®Ó².

If I have time and no one beats me to it, I may venture a translation of the parts I can make out so that others can have a crack at intepreting the meaning.

Take care,
Audi

Greetings Audi,

Re: һν֮»¬ and Ò»»¬Ö®Ó².

This is just from someone's commentary, and I think the second hua is just a typo. It should probably be a parallel statement:
һν֮»¬ and һν֮Ӳ. That is, two examples of errors that can result from allowing the forms to fall into a fixed pattern. "One is called hua (slick/facile), and one is called ying (rigid/stiff)."

Take care,
Louis

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Louis Swaim:
<B>Greetings Audi,

Re: һν֮»¬ and Ò»»¬Ö®Ó².

This is just from someone's commentary, and I think the second hua is just a typo. It should probably be a parallel statement:
һν֮»¬ and һν֮Ӳ. That is, two examples of errors that can result from allowing the forms to fall into a fixed pattern. "One is called hua (slick/facile), and one is called ying (rigid/stiff)."

Take care,
Louis</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Could it be "One is called hua (slick/facile), and other is stiffness (ying) of this slickness" ?
Maybe the commentator's point is that the second comes consequently as a result of hua (slickness)?

Hi Yuri,

Re: "Maybe the commentator's point is that the second comes consequently as a result of hua (slickness)?"

I tried to see this causative relationship between the two phrases too, but the grammar does not work. On the other hand, the structure, Yi wei X, Yi wei Y is a common way of writing, so I think that's what was intended in the commentary. Keep in mind also that the two conditions, hua and ying, are presented as separate results in the source text as well.

--Louis

[This message has been edited by Louis Swaim (edited 11-17-2005).]

Louis,

Thanks for the correction.
I am not skilled in Chinese language and its tones so I defer to you.

Thanks again

Greetings Shugdenla,

No problem. I welcome the discussion. Forgive me if I seem obsessive with my laser beam, but I tend to enjoy unraveling these early taiji texts.

Take care,
Louis

when your lazerbeams and obsession produces the books that you write nobody minds

in fact a great many people are very grateful!

Hi Louis, my Chinese is rusty and not strong to begin with, but perhaps the meaning is closer to "cunning/insincere" than slippery in this usage? I am not sure how a set form would cause any problem with that, but just a random thought.