Yang Family Tai Chi Discussion Board

First time in ring so bear with some of the sloppiness. I know...i know- you'll say "where is the tai chi?" "its not Tai chi"....It was chinese sanda rules so take downs are legal. Earlier Tai chi practice that day did help with breathing and relaxing.

i didnt have my 12 oz. gloves so had to use 14 oz. other than that it was fun and i felt alright afterwards. my boxing coaches trained me good for this and so the endurance part wasnt a shocker.


pre-fight
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WZKzH0xD4Q

1-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Woo5oZBdWNA

2-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=229rZNiojlc

3-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrQxjXt3T_o

I have trained Yang Taiji for a long time (well over 10 years) and within the last 2 years I got into Sanda, basically because the opportunity presented itself, it is the military version (that is what my sifu was trained in mainland) not geared towards the ring but I am considering giving the ring a try next year. And doing some additional training the next time I am in China.

And those takedowns hurt on the ground I can’t imagine they feel much better in the ring. You got a draw and that’s not bad for your first time.

It takes guts to climb into the ring, my hats off to you


[This message has been edited by T (edited 09-23-2007).]

T- good luck on your match- my coaches did one great thing- had me do a training on the weekend that was a enduarnce and stamina killer. that training prepared me for the toughness needed in the ring. Cardio all the way. Cant tell you what we did exactly since its 'top secret' but i will tell you- practice alot of running, push ups, situps, jump squants, 50 yard dash 10X little rest period, strength conditioning ect.

It was a draw- i showed it to several sanda people (it was at a Muay thai smoker event- judges didnt know what they were watching) and the judges didnt score me on my takedowns and agressiveness. Everyone said I should have won.

But a draw is better than a lose.

[This message has been edited by mls_72 (edited 09-24-2007).]

Thanks and thanks for the training tips

I know, cardio is important, a friend of mine, that use to fight, has said many times don’t even consider getting into the ring unless you are running "AT LEAST" 5 miles a day… and I really do not like running so I have some work to do before I get there.

My sifu already has me doing a lot of push ups, sit-ups, dips, chin ups (he loves chin ups) as well as other things for training I cannot discuss either but as I said he is not training me for the ring and I will have to do much more cardio before I step into a ring.

Good luck to you in you future matches


[This message has been edited by T (edited 09-25-2007).]

[This message has been edited by T (edited 09-25-2007).]

[This message has been edited by T (edited 09-25-2007).]

T,

We did running but only 1 to 2 miles every other day. However- lots of punches and kicks with partner, bags, focus mitts, thai pads. training to exhaustion- T-shirt and clothes drenched with sweat.

matt

Thanks, I like that much better than the 5 mile run plus everything else.

I can handle 1 to 2 miles every other day

Again thanks

Also several rounds shadow box alot with imagining getting hit alot. use alot of circling, defense and offense moves.

spar alot and take good training notes. Keep a journal.If your teacher is a champion with titles that helps alot too, they will let you know what to expect-

here are some of my notes
- in the Morning Am hours i always did 'ba duan jin' and Yang taiji form, push hands.

At my school in the pm:

8/15/07 Boxing:
3 round shadow box
Focus mitts: take left hit and rt. hit(head or body) return with cross and hook (opponet allowed to throw at openings)
Drill 100 punches
2. coach call – do a jab cross hook and circle/move
Drill 100 hooks
3. Blast 4
Drill 100 uppercuts

Strength conditioning- stations
Burpies, push ups, kettle bell: press ups. Kettle bell: raise to chest, knee to chest jumps

8/17/07 Muay thai notes-

Running, hopping, one leg hopping, zip zag one leg hopping, running high knees, double stepping with double rt. Cross, running, conditioning.

Partner work:
Choose either 1. jab and rt. Kick 2. cross and left kick, 3. left hook rt. Kick or 4. rt. Upper cut left kick
Partner will block with either catch/parry method or crazy moneky.

Choose either 1. jab, cros,s let kick 2. left hook cross left kick 3. rt. Cross, k..left hook rt. Kick 4. jab rt. Upper cut left kick
Partner blocks with gloves or crazy monkey

Jab, rt. Shuttle hook to body, left shuttle hook to body and rt. Kick
Level 1: jab, cross, hook, rt. Kick

Low left hook, high left hook, rt. Hook. Left hook- rt. Kick

20 left and rt. High push kicks.

Strength conditioning-
20 Push ups
20 V-ups
20 Burpies

100 sit ups
1 min. plank
30 sec. side plank
30 sec. other side plank
15 side plank push ups
15 other side plank push ups.

8/21/07 Muay Thai Class:
Running, hopping one leg, diagonal hopping
Partner combos:
1. jab/rt. Kick
2. left hook rt. Kick
3. cross, left kick
4. rt. Upper cut/left kick

1. jab cross left kick
2. hook cross rt. Kick
3. cross hook, rt. Kick
4. jab, upper cut/left kick
5. jab, rt. Body hook, left body hook, rt. Kick
6. left body punch, left high hook, rt. Hook, left hook, rt. Kick
7. 20 high push kicks left and rt.


8/25/07 Muay Thai class- "oh shit" kick defense
1. take 2-4 punches, step off 'train tracks' kick the leg, waist, push kick
2. add 4 punches: either: 3 jab and cross, 4 jabs, jab cross jab cross,
3. rt. Foot range detect and superman punch
4. superman punch, left uppercut, cross, round kick
5. fake left push kick and step back jab, cross, rt. Push kick
6. block kick, step back jab, cross, push kick
7. block kick, superman punch- left uppercut, rt. Cross
8. shadow box all combos learned

Shadow box warm-up-
1. all rt. Arm techniques
2. all left arm techniques
3. all leg techniqes (defense and offense)
4. both arms
5. all- punches and kicks, defense ect.

Boxing- 3 rounds shadowboxing
Circle drill and 4 punches when changing direction
Focus mitts- round 1- uppercut, round 2 – uppercut hook, round 3- uppercut hook uppercut
Strength training:
1. hopping cartwheel
2. fireman carry
3. carry on back
4. foot on body push ups
5. foot on body situps
6. leap frog –leg dives
7. back to back wall sits

Shin: sparred 2x
My primary techniqes used: jab, cross , hook, kicks, body punches
Used Little:- upper cuts and push kicks, knees and throws
Forgot to use: high kicks
Should of used more: body punches and hooks
Side notes: shin is school instructor and fight team veteran…he is large and out weighs me- he moves a lot and would be more of a 'stalker' type fighter against me. Shin is very strong and his judo take downs are fierce. Cannot use throws against him but primarily have to move away from his strong body punches and hooks.

Kareem: sparred 4 x
Primary tech used- clinch, knees and jab cross hook
Used little- round kicks and push kicks
Forgot to use- upper cuts, better defense for his hooks
Should of used more- foot jab with combinations and then move out.
Personal notes: Kareem is fight team veteran and doesn't know his own strength a majority of the time, his left hook practically knocked me out. My best chance with him was to stay out of his range and move, try to stop some of his rt kicks, and clinch and knee him to avoid the flurry on punches. Kareem like to dirty box as in hitting leg and back of head. Style: slugger.

Latif: sparred 4x
Primary tech used- combos of jab cross , hook, wing chun: chain punch, push kick, round kick, knees
Used little- high kicks and body kicks, combinations
Forgot to use- body hits
Should of used more: body hits defense from his high kick
Personal notes- Latif has a tremendous amount of energy. I think he is most likely to be like my opponent at smoker. Latif has some good combos but steps into my foot jab a lot. Also The wing chun chain punch up his center line was effective. He moves quickly and had good defense, a lot of my combinations attacks were not effective enough.

Shawn: sparred once
Primary technique: jab cross, rt. Kick, push kick, hook
Used little: throws, clinch , knees
Forgot to use- upper cuts
Should of used more- combinations
Personal notes- shawn is a great wrestler strength and has good stamina, his strikes and kicks and timing is somewhat off and his balance is awkward. I had an advantage in this area, but he does have strong punches.

Jeff (not jeff ruth)- sparred 3x
Primary tech used- boxing- jab cross hooks upper cuts, clinch
Used little: kicks
Forgot to use: better defense from hook and body blows, in and out movement
Should of used more- lateral movement and blending.
Personal notes: Jeff is very strong and hits hard like a slugger, he primarily uses hands and my best moves against him were blending or matching his moves. He hit me very hard a few times and has strong body blows. Clinching helped stop him.

Sam- sparred 2x
Primary tech used- circling- in and out combination attacks, low kicks, body shots
Used little- clinch, take downs
Forgot to use: high kicks push kicks
Should of used more- push kicks
Personal notes: Sam is huge, has good combinations, hits hard, he actually moves fast, likes to circle and angle.


Zev- sparred 2 x
Primary tech used- jab cross hook push kick round kick, clinch, knees
Used little- circling, lateral movement,
Forgot to use- parry, counter punching, bob/weave, kick catch and defense
Should of used more: kick countes and returns, shielding, crazy monkey
Personal notes: Zev seems very experienced and had good swift combinations. He has strong kicks and foot jab. Strong punches and is an intelligent fighter. I seem him as a stalker type fighter that could easily just pick me off in my vulnerable areas.

Logan- sparred 2x
Primary tech used: jab cross, combinations, foot jab, spin kick, rt and left round kicks
Used little: clinch and body punches, knees
Forgot to use: circling movement, multiple attacks
Should of used more: upper cuts, parry, angle and punch
Notes: Logan does a flurry of careless attacks, he is strong and aggressive, but leaves a lot of openings- he might actually be a lot like my opponent. He walks right into your kick or punch.

Dave Carter- sparred 5 x
Primary tech used- jab cross hook, foot jab, round kick, clinch and knees
Used little: combinations, effective knees, body punches, low kicks
Forgot to use- sweeps, leg kicks, body kicks
Should of used more- circling, crazy monkey defense, parry, faints
Notes: Dave is a instructor and top champion fighter at the school, he was effective a lot with super man punch and combinations, clinch using dirty boxing and hitting the leg was recommended, Dave is big and strong so take downs are not effective, take downs are easy from him, combination from dave flurry was not easy or his leg kicks. Intelligent fighter with knock out power..

Vivek- sparred 2x
Primary tech used- defense- crazy monkey, jab, cross, hooks, upper cuts, take downs, clinch
Used little- in and out and circular movement, angles
Forgot to use- round kicks and foot jabs, combinations
Should of used more: circling, in and out combinations, kick catches, sweeps
Notes; vivek is a instructor and top champion fighter at school, basically I'm out skilled with flurry of strikes and take downs are second nature to vivek, I needed to circle more and be on the defensive he is a combination "stalker/slugger". He was throwing a lot of the same techniques I had to be on defensie. Good throws and high kicks, fast hands and strong stamina. Knock out power.

Tony talbert- sparred once
Primary tech used- jab, cross, circling, hooks, body punches
Used little- level changes, in and out movement, slip
Forgot to use- upper cuts, bob and weave and head movement, angling
Should of used more- footwork, tight body
Notes: tony is top champion fighter at school and is very accurate and patient fightr, I tended to walk right into his punches, he would angle off my attack and throw an upper cut or jab cross. I ate his punches heavily. He is tall and ha good reach, I was weak in getting to the inside or going for outside.

Derek Sierra- sparred once (3 rounds boxing)
Used- jab, cross, hooks, upper cuts- clinch, circling, slip, bob/weave
Used little- upper cuts .
Forgot to use- body blows, level changes.
Should of used moredistance- stay away from his clinch and uppercut
Nores: Derek is instructor and pro Boxer, fight team veteran, Derek can take punches and has huge amount of strength and endurance, has a strong flurry of punches and can easily control the fight with someone of my level. Knock out power.



[This message has been edited by mls_72 (edited 09-27-2007).]

Hi Matt,

Congratulations on your courage and your performance.

What exactly were the rules? I found some of the officiating difficult to understand. For instance, how can you allow takedowns, but discourage clinches?

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I know...i know- you'll say "where is the tai chi?" "its not Tai chi"....It was chinese sanda rules so take downs are legal.</font>

I am not sure I follow your reasoning here. I would think that take downs are an integral part of most Tai Chi systems and that sanda rules could otherwise handle Tai Chi. I can also understand, however, why you might not want to use
Tai Chi with gloves on and in this sort of forum.

Would you mind sharing how you accomodate training both in boxing and in Tai Chi? Do you find them complementary, conflicting, or simply alternative approaches.

Take care,
Audi

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by mls_72:
Also several rounds shadow box alot with imagining getting hit alot. use alot of circling, defense and offense moves....</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thank You.

What I train is the Sanda of the Police and Military in China. That is what my sifu learned. He fought in China but I am not exaclty sure in what type of forum. If I go to the ring I do this on my own, at least for now. Thanks for the info

T



[This message has been edited by T (edited 10-01-2007).]

All that is cool and nothing wrong with training boxing, sparring, and MT, but since you seem to spend more time practicing external methods than internal (going by what you said), how is that you think you are really using any tai chi chuan at all?? Frankly, and I mean no disrespect, but I see no TCC body method or energies at all in what you are doing. As far as I know, bouncing around with gloves throwing jabs is not martial TCC. I could be wrong, but I'd like to hear what others (the silent majority out here) think as well??

[This message has been edited by yielding (edited 10-01-2007).]

oops, i just noticed you said it was NOT tai chi chuan. My mistake. Why do you post this on a tai chi website though? Just curious.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by yielding:
<B>All that is cool and nothing wrong with training boxing, sparring, and MT, but since you seem to spend more time practicing external methods than internal (going by what you said), how is that you think you are really using any tai chi chuan at all?? Frankly, and I mean no disrespect, but I see no TCC body method or energies at all in what you are doing. As far as I know, bouncing around with gloves throwing jabs is not martial TCC. I could be wrong, but I'd like to hear what others (the silent majority out here) think as well??

[This message has been edited by yielding (edited 10-01-2007).]</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree that Sanshou is not taijiquan, and I mean no disrespectbut, just out of curiosity what do you consider martial taijiquan?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by T:
I agree that Sanshou is not taijiquan, and I mean no disrespectbut, just out of curiosity what do you consider martial taijiquan?</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

well, i am no TCC fighter, and these days I'd say they are very few and far between, but what insight we can gather from the earlier generation guys - i would say to start with they would not being wearing gloves. also, there would be some display of quick light cat like stepping as well as some sharp pointed jin strikes - remember the story of Tian Zhaolin fighting the boxer? according to those eye-witness accounts, it was a very quick step, quick strike, and the guy was thrown many feet away - if that story is correct i would say some internal energy was combined with that strike to cause such a result. what i do not invision is a TCC fighter to be bobbing up and down, wearing gloves, and throwing jabs. how do you think it should look like? as far as i know, there are no real clips of actual tc masters fighting, so we are left to our own devices.....

Yielding,
You have obviously never seen this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8VbSc1r5UI

Enjoy!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Bob Ashmore:
<B>Yielding,
You have obviously never seen this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8VbSc1r5UI

Enjoy! </B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

thx Bob, i have indeed seen that, but i do not see much tcc on display there. besides everyone knows that was just a charity event so they were only "playing" with each other. Or, are you just playing with me?? lol.